Changing ip's kills certain process's

[Master Shake]

 1."Ok reading this, this is what I get just to surmise for Sir Emi" hardly constitutes "furthering the discussion",its a summary of what was already stated.
 2. Killing remote AV gives the virii slingers an easy advantage-heres how.
   
    I start disinfecting Mr. Xs virii,and he notices almost instantly. Using my 20 bounces to get there,I disconnect and wait for the timer. I could-a) wait for the timer and hope for the best,or b) change my IP and IN AN HOUR I could get away. In the meantime,Mr. X is on my trail-and for the sake of argument well say it takes him 3 minutes per bounce to read through the logs and go to the next node. I still havent made up my mind after an hour passes and Mr. X just showed on my logs. I still have the option to change password and IP,but at this point,theres no real need-Mr. X has killed the process already. If I would have changed IPs,and not spent the HOUR to deliberate it,I would have gotten away. Short version-take away the ability to maintain disinfect after an IP change,and the people who can sort through logs quickly will NEVER have a virii disinfected ( and thats not taking into account the numerous hours it takes to disinfect some things). Is this overpowered? Not if your near the top of the list and your buddies are watching your stuff,but for anyone else that wants to get anywhere,its a lesson in futility.
    References to real life examples are uneeded,as this is a gameplay issue,not a continuity debate.

   That "furthering the discussion"?

[virus man]

1."Ok reading this, this is what I get just to surmise for Sir Emi" hardly constitutes "furthering the discussion",its a summary of what was already stated.
 2. Killing remote AV gives the virii slingers an easy advantage-heres how.
   
    I start disinfecting Mr. Xs virii,and he notices almost instantly. Using my 20 bounces to get there,I disconnect and wait for the timer. I could-a) wait for the timer and hope for the best,or b) change my IP and IN AN HOUR I could get away. In the meantime,Mr. X is on my trail-and for the sake of argument well say it takes him 3 minutes per bounce to read through the logs and go to the next node. I still havent made up my mind after an hour passes and Mr. X just showed on my logs. I still have the option to change password and IP,but at this point,theres no real need-Mr. X has killed the process already. If I would have changed IPs,and not spent the HOUR to deliberate it,I would have gotten away. Short version-take away the ability to maintain disinfect after an IP change,and the people who can sort through logs quickly will NEVER have a virii disinfected ( and thats not taking into account the numerous hours it takes to disinfect some things). Is this overpowered? Not if your near the top of the list and your buddies are watching your stuff,but for anyone else that wants to get anywhere,its a lesson in futility.
    References to real life examples are uneeded,as this is a gameplay issue,not a continuity debate.

   That "furthering the discussion"?

1> it was surmising and ensuring I understand the idea behind this which does further the conversation by removing misunderstandings as anyone knows.

2> IP change takes an hour to happen as you know already.   So your whole argument against the change is mute based on the scenario you just gave.

[Master Shake]

  The hour buffer time I refer to is the current prevention of misuse. It gives a solid hour of tracking time before the "nurse" drops off the radar. Does the time on the IP change need to be increased? Maybe. But how much time is enough to not unbalance other aspects?

  Some of the virii (even admitted by yourself) take DAYS to disinfect.

  Without the ability to maintain a disinfect after IP change,it gives virii slingers 72 hours to find their target. 3 entire days to rally your buddies and scour every IP to kill a process that takes 8 days to disinfect its target. Your honestly going to tell me this isnt in favor of people who overuse virii? And how would you suggest people do disinfect missions when you have no actual chance of getting away with it? I can track haphazardly through 20 bounces inbetween an hour and 2,accurately. If my target has to be there to keep the disinfect running,that only gives me 70 more hours to kill the process!
 
   Yeah,this isnt overpowered,lol.
 

[virus man]

  The hour buffer time I refer to is the current prevention of misuse. It gives a solid hour of tracking time before the "nurse" drops off the radar. Does the time on the IP change need to be increased? Maybe. But how much time is enough to not unbalance other aspects?

  Some of the virii (even admitted by yourself) take DAYS to disinfect.

  Without the ability to maintain a disinfect after IP change,it gives virii slingers 72 hours to find their target. 3 entire days to rally your buddies and scour every IP to kill a process that takes 8 days to disinfect its target. Your honestly going to tell me this isnt in favor of people who overuse virii? And how would you suggest people do disinfect missions when you have no actual chance of getting away with it? I can track haphazardly through 20 bounces inbetween an hour and 2,accurately. If my target has to be there to keep the disinfect running,that only gives me 70 more hours to kill the process!
 
   Yeah,this isnt overpowered,lol.
 

It takes me less than 10 minutes unless I have to crack admin on any systems to track someone down.

IT is not over powered.

You have Log Delete.  If you don't research it then that is your problem.

You have Firewall Protect.  IF you don't stay on top of it then that is your problem.

You have Password Protect.  If you don't stay on top of it then that is your problem.

That is 3 ways with SOFTWARE to keep yourself safe.  IP Change should not be a way to avoid having to do the research on those software especially with how CHEAP IP change is in the current economy.

After all lets take a .1 File-Share virus disinfect.  You get 3.35K HPD for it.  IP Change still leaves you with a profit of 2.35K and ZERO risk.

With the way things are starting to go in this game it is going to be useless to do any research except for AV's.  Heck I could right now probably disinfect every .1 File-share at once and just change my IP making it impossible to track me.  Imagine how much of a RISK FREE profit I would make.

To say IP Change should stay the way it is now tells me straight up You are one of the ones abusing it.  It is far to powerful in it's current state.

[Crlaozwyn]

Scour every IP to find a random one? Are you kidding? There are about 4.5 billion possible IP addresses. We're just supposed to "guess" the right one if someone starts stealing our viruses while we're asleep? Since people can easily check if you're online or not, it's not difficult to time your attack. Stealing a virus should be difficult, not a guarantee.

I've got to be honest, between this and the uselessness of hide (the fact that you can steal viruses you can't even see), I'm strongly considering finding another game. This game is too small to be losing players.

[Master Shake]

  You know what? Go ahead-You and your little clique can all sit around and be invulnerable,while all the potential paying new players get too frustrated trying to do anything and go elsewhere. I give up,and if this actually happens,I wont let the doorknob hit me where the dog shoulda bit me. Enjoy your stay at the top of a dying game.

[Tiak]

1."Ok reading this, this is what I get just to surmise for Sir Emi" hardly constitutes "furthering the discussion",its a summary of what was already stated.
 2. Killing remote AV gives the virii slingers an easy advantage-heres how.
   
    I start disinfecting Mr. Xs virii,and he notices almost instantly. Using my 20 bounces to get there,I disconnect and wait for the timer. I could-a) wait for the timer and hope for the best,or b) change my IP and IN AN HOUR I could get away. In the meantime,Mr. X is on my trail-and for the sake of argument well say it takes him 3 minutes per bounce to read through the logs and go to the next node. I still havent made up my mind after an hour passes and Mr. X just showed on my logs. I still have the option to change password and IP,but at this point,theres no real need-Mr. X has killed the process already. If I would have changed IPs,and not spent the HOUR to deliberate it,I would have gotten away. Short version-take away the ability to maintain disinfect after an IP change,and the people who can sort through logs quickly will NEVER have a virii disinfected ( and thats not taking into account the numerous hours it takes to disinfect some things). Is this overpowered? Not if your near the top of the list and your buddies are watching your stuff,but for anyone else that wants to get anywhere,its a lesson in futility.
    References to real life examples are uneeded,as this is a gameplay issue,not a continuity debate.

   That "furthering the discussion"?

Well, if Mr. X is capable of never sleeping and checking every one of his viruses on all servers every minute, he certainly deserves that much...

[virus man]

  You know what? Go ahead-You and your little clique can all sit around and be invulnerable,while all the potential paying new players get too frustrated trying to do anything and go elsewhere. I give up,and if this actually happens,I wont let the doorknob hit me where the dog shoulda bit me. Enjoy your stay at the top of a dying game.

You know what.  Almost every person in my group including me are Gold members.   Gold status makes you untouchable as is.  You can NEVER lose your software as a Gold member.  Oh and just so you know that means a paying player.

Now as for the new players.  They quit because of people like you, after all you and a few others have bragged about this, finding them due to their mistakes as new players and hosing them.

I am trying to make the game better for all.   Not just the top and not just the bottom.   Sadly though all you can do is try to insult me when I posed actual facts to counter your argument.

So you have shown us that yes you are one of those who abuses this tactic.

[Master Shake]

  1. I am a Gold member-Your preaching to the choir there.
  2. Find one instance of me bragging about picking on new players-just one,anywhere-You wont.
  3."I am trying to make the game better for all"-Who is "all"? Wheres the poll? What gives you the ego to think you can speak for "all"?
  4. What insult?
  5. Im changing IP right now as a matter of fact-I do so almost every 4 days. Did I earn the cash to do it? Yeah,I did.Is that abusing the system? Thats up for another debate in itself.

[Crlaozwyn]

The allure of this game is that's it's a game of skill and tact. If you remove both elements by allowing players to always steal viruses, the allure is gone and the game becomes pointless.

[virus man]

  1. I am a Gold member-Your preaching to the choir there.
  2. Find one instance of me bragging about picking on new players-just one,anywhere-You wont.
  3."I am trying to make the game better for all"-Who is "all"? Wheres the poll? What gives you the ego to think you can speak for "all"?
  4. What insult?
  5. Im changing IP right now as a matter of fact-I do so almost every 4 days. Did I earn the cash to do it? Yeah,I did.Is that abusing the system? Thats up for another debate in itself.

1> Then you know as well as I do that being a Gold Member pretty makes you immune to any software loss.
2> Here goes.
2a> Here you insult the player base by grouping them as "punk 12 year olds" as well as insulting Nose instead of providing constructive criticism.  http://www.hacker-project.com/forum/index.php?topic=347.0
2b> Here you yet again insult someone within the game by "spending all your hpd to find some retards ip" http://www.hacker-project.com/forum/index.php?topic=327.0
2c> Here you allude to picking on people http://www.hacker-project.com/forum/index.php?topic=183.30
2d> Not going to keep searching as I have a long day tomorrow doing a vehicle recovery but I think I made my primary point.
3> Simple if someone who has the HPD via Donation or being in the game longer does the same thing to a reasonable new player how can they even bother trying to retaliate?
4> Your previous comment can be construed that way.  It sounded to me like you were basically saying "You know what?  You are an egomaniac that won't listen to anyone else."  Understand sometimes it is not what you say but what is insinuated..
5> That is good that you are changing your IP.  But did you do it when you started doing something like say a Virus Hijack or Disinfection?

Anyways peace out I am off to bed once I finish my rounds in game and here on the forums.  So catch you later and lets try to get back on topic shall we?

[Master Shake]

"They quit because of people like you, after all you and a few others have bragged about this, finding them due to their mistakes as new players and hosing them."
   
      My personal opinions of people doesnt excactly qualify as "picking on them". Your examples are merely my perceptions of others,not evidence of "finding them due to their mistakes as new players and hosing them". And I have no idea what example 2>c has to even do with the topic. At no point in time did I directly insult anyone. And no,Im not in the middle of any disinfect/hijack. Im closing up shop for good I think- Its supposed to be fun,but since their is no way to curb the growth rate of the higher end players without it sounding like a nursery,its just going to spiral out of control-And I said in one of my first posts here-
     "When there are no enemies,friends turn on each other"

    Time will tell.

[Tiak]

I have no problems with IP changing as a whole, but as-is there is basically zero chance of you being found in that hour, let's say there are two IPs to be cracked obstructing the path, which is common enough for the people doing a lot of IP changes.  At 10 minutes each, and, let's say, 5 minutes combined for all other nodes that were bounced through, we come to a grand total of 25 minutes to find...  Then let us say another 20 minutes to crack the password of the IP-changer, bringing us to 45 minutes to cancel.  Let's say the one who did it wasn't that good at this IP changing bit and had a 15 minute delay after the offensive process started before he started an IP change...   This would mean that the player who is getting their stuff messed with would have to check at least every 30 minutes to ensure that they keep their stuff...  Checking every virus 48 times a day is impossible, making it rather futile.  In this case even if they do find the culprit, the only thing that does, is keep their stuff from being erased/stolen...  That is it.  The remaining part of that hour will never be enough to even temporarily damage the capabilities of the offender to steal more stuf.

The above of course makes a silly assumption...  It assumes that it takes an hour after an action to change an IP to begin with...  This is a stupid assumption.  There is nothing that keeps someone from queuing up IP changes before they take action, which is much more common, and is the real problem here.  If someone finishes a queued IP change immediately after starting an action, nobody can touch them, it is as simple as that.

That is invulnerability, just like having good software is, only this invulnerability takes little to no actual work to gain.  Humans play this game and realistically, they have neither the patience, nor the physical stamina, nor the available resources to sit on their asses all day and track every single one of their virii in this game.  If someone -does- have a particularly large amount of time to play here, this is further balanced by them tending to have more viruses to check and more other things to do here...

I propose a compromise of two simple changes to fix things a bit:
1.  Make IP changes take longer.  60 minutes is a rather short span of time compared to other actions in this game, and does not give anyone a reasonable chance of finding someone.  I propose that the new time be 2.5 hours.  This is long enough to conceivably track and crack someone in most conditions, but short enough that it is still impractical to consistently detect.  This also would make it less convenient to keep an IP change at ready before taking action in case #2 isn't adopted.
2.  Make it impossible to start -new- actions during an IP change.  Rather than kill processes when the change takes place, it would also work to make it so one is unable to start new deletions etc. while an IP change is already going...  This way people are actually limited by the time restrictions, whether the delay itself is increased or not.

[XRay]

Without the ability to maintain a disinfect after IP change,it gives virii slingers 72 hours to find their target. 3 entire days to rally your buddies and scour every IP to kill a process that takes 8 days to disinfect its target.

Now if you want to disinfect or take over high-profile virii, you should have to make some effort.

1.) You could cooperate with other players and research a log deleter to stay hidden. After all, the people who research viruses must put their money into bandwidth, virus research and log undeleters, so even if you have only a fraction of their resources, you should be fine to become invisible by log deleting.

2.) You could also increase your firewall and PW protect instead. This may be harder because PW breakers can be overdriven, but you should be safe from the weaker virus users like me.

3.) Otherwise you could bounce through some nodes you prepared with a sniffer daemon so that your enemy has to crack every single admin on his way. Non-gold users should be given more bounces to allow this tactic - they need at least 10 bounces -  but you can gain up to one hour cracking time per node this way.

Hey, you can even combine all these strategies for dangerous jobs. Way more fun than clicking "disinfect" or "virus takeover" and become invincible behind an all-defeating IP change, right?

What I want to say is: The current way of changing IPs takes away the point of many of the nice features in the game, like bouncing, faking and tracing logs, protection software and strategic decisions about what to do to keep a low profile.


[Edit] I should add that I don't say this to defend my own turfs. I'm lacking in research - as a strategy decision - and can therefore be defeated easily by any of the above techniques. I use 0.1 viruses and 0.2 hiders, and my log undelete sucks just as bad. I just want the no-research tactics to be one option of many. If I choose to not invest in defenses, I should have to refrain from doing 1000+ HPD missions in order to compensate for the resources I saved.

[Crlaozwyn]

One more thing to note: It's been said that this "feature" is in place to protect the smaller players... so they can occasionally get away with a disinfect or stealing a virus. Here's some quick math: stealing a v.55 virus takes 1650 CPU and 63250 memory. Fourteen of them were being stolen by the same person, at the same time. That means they were using 19800 CPU and 759000 memory at the same time, just on me. Smaller players have to drop their firewall and password just to run one... Who's really benefiting from this? Is it the smaller players? Clearly not. The players who already have impressive servers are using this to gain even more of an advantage. Those small players who only have half a dozen viruses up are losing those and don't have the system resources to steal them back.