Changing ip's kills certain process's

[Crlaozwyn]

Bringing this to the top of the pile again - still dealing with this issue. What are you thinking, siremi?

[virus man]

Hey I say SGP start using this technique.

After all it seems that whatever SGP does Sir Emi does something to try and stop it.

So SGP start using God Mode please.

[Raistlin]

You mean you guys aren't already?

[virus man]

You mean you guys aren't already?

Nope.  We were taking the high road on this matter.  Heck some of the SGP members have the same IP since they started.

But here is a little trick.

[removed exploit description]

That is how I get Soviet's IP, Ivan's IP, and a few others at zero cost to myself.

[ivandrago]

Ivan's IP ........ 

Are there missions against me ?? And i thought i had been one of the good hackers so far.

I'd like to add to this debate that at this point the IP change is too much of an exploit.
I won't explain in detail how to, but there's tens of thousand of HPD to make in just 24 hours if you select the right missions and do an ip change.
There definitely needs to be a major setback to an ip change somehow. 1000 HPD just doesnt match up to the benefits it gives.

Might i suggest a 3 or 4 day (maybe even more?) period of waiting for your ISP to complete the IP change. In this period no outbound and inbound connection can be made.

And i'd also like to state that i'm on the desinfecting-side and although i could have, i have never used ip change to protect myself from being traced by the owner of the mission objective.
So feel free to come in and kill the corresponding process but plz don't touch my files and my other processes !

[siremi]

You mean you guys aren't already?

Nope.  We were taking the high road on this matter.  Heck some of the SGP members have the same IP since they started.

But here is a little trick.

[removed exploit description]

That is how I get Soviet's IP, Ivan's IP, and a few others at zero cost to myself.

I am currently investigating what you described to see if it works or not.
It it does, then it will be treated as a bug and fixed.

[EDIT:]

The described exploit to acquire the new IP does NOT WORK.
It may have worked in the beginning of the game about 20 days ago, but that was fixed when several other bugs where fixed.
Once again, it does NOT work.

Please do not post false information, especially regarding exploits.


The number of IP changes has dramatically gone down due to the 300 AP cost.
There is no need to nerf it more at this time.

[Crlaozwyn]

GAH! You realize that it's been nearly two weeks since I traced a remote disinfect trail back to a legit IP? That hasn't stopped. No offense intended, but I think you're the only person who doesn't acknowledge this as an issue. Do you actually play this game or just code it? I understand why you wouldn't play the game, it does make sense... but ultimately, you make money on this game because we're happy to be here and spend that money. If the unanimous cry is "this is a problem!" why are you so hesitant to fix it? The happier we are, the more money you get.

[Raistlin]

Siremi, I don't think looking at the number of IP changes is a valid measure of whether or not it is being abused. Instead, look at the number of powerful disinfects (Namely, those of .3 or .4 file share virii) that can actually be stopped. I'm guessing the number is less than 5%. I know that I, for one, change IP IMMEDIATELY anytime I initiate a disinfect worth 8k or more, and I specifically try to initiate as many as I can, then make myself untraceable. Since a file share .3 takes around 40 hours to disinfect, 300 AP isn't a high cost to pay. Are you seriously saying that isn't abusable?

[siremi]

Siremi, I don't think looking at the number of IP changes is a valid measure of whether or not it is being abused. Instead, look at the number of powerful disinfects (Namely, those of .3 or .4 file share virii) that can actually be stopped. I'm guessing the number is less than 5%. I know that I, for one, change IP IMMEDIATELY anytime I initiate a disinfect worth 8k or more, and I specifically try to initiate as many as I can, then make myself untraceable. Since a file share .3 takes around 40 hours to disinfect, 300 AP isn't a high cost to pay. Are you seriously saying that isn't abusable?

I'm only saying the virus profits greatly outwage the risks of disinfecting + profits + IP Change.

You can try this:
- lose all your virii
- specialize your gateway in disinfecting
- fight against a group composed of the Top 6 players that will hunt you down every time they see a disinfect

You have to understand that I have to take both sides into consideration.

This topic has only replies from people that have their viruses disinfected, but there are those that specialize in disinfecting.

Now those that do that will not rely on viruses, and don't even have an income from viruses. They may not even like viruses, that probably why they are specializing in disinfection.

I understand that they are an annoyance for those that install viruses, but they are not a threat. They are simply using the tools provided for the purpose of fending off the gank of hackers that will surely come after them.

I can assure you, I am aware of everything that is happening in the game.

[Raistlin]

Siremi, I tried exactly what you said a while ago. That's how I got my start. I only started doing virii at all in the past few days, and even then, just to use the space of things I disinfected. I believe I may well have been the first to start abusing the IP change, and I'm one of those with the most to lose by it's change. I've got 30 or 40k of disinfect missions running safely, and that's my primary source of income. However, I really do think that the abusability of the IP change is bad for the game.

[ivandrago]

Very well said siremi. The way you put it, it makes sense.
Since i'm a desinfector i have no idea how much money the virii brings in.

And from my point of view it is a good thing that the strongest players are also confronted with some matters that they cannot control with their superior software.

[siremi]

I really do think that the abusability of the IP change is bad for the game.

Well, we have two options:

#1 - keep IP Change the way it is for now, while protecting the lower players and have a possible abuse on our hands

#2 - increase AP cost, opening the way for high players to grief lower players by:
       -> eliminate those that disinfect or reduce their damage on the virii to a minimum (causing them to leave HP)
       -> leaving high players open for exponential growth (causing newbie to leave HP due to no match for God)
       -> infecting all secret servers with high level virii (causing newbie to leave HP due to no room)
       -> not allowing others to grow

From the two options, the first was chosen as being the lesser evil.

That may change in the future, depending on how the game evolves.

[Raistlin]

Fair enough. I agree that it is the lesser of two evils, and I admit I can't offer a better solution. I just wanted to post to make sure that people knew it was still an issue, something that feels a trifle broken. I guess I'll keep an eye on the game, and suggest things as they occur to me ;)

[Crlaozwyn]

We have more than those two options - you're just not willing to consider them. There is option #3, which is what this entire thread has been about - "changing ip's kills certain process's." You're convinced that this protects the "lower" players. Please, give me a profile of the "lower" players? What does their computer look like? How much money do they donate, and how many hours per day do they play? Feel free to leave it the way it is; I'm convinced that's what's going to happen anyways. But, for as long as this game manages to retain my interest (the time is decreasing quickly as issues such as this are labeled features. This is worse than Microsoft - "Those blue screens ensure that people reboot their computer, which is good for it!"), I'll argue for what I see as the good of the game.

If people can't always hide by changing their IP, will processes get shut down? Definitely. It's that balance that attracted me to this game in the first place - the fact that everything had a counter. Right now, I've legitimately gotten myself into a position of power - I worked hard for it. Regardless of the fact that I've played by every rule, the rules are constantly changing (and I believe they will KEEP changing until either the top 6 quit, or everyone else catches up). Every game has winners, and every game has losers. If everyone is a winner, then they're all losers too - we all started and fought on an equal playing field. I started later than anyone else in the top 10, and later than most in the top 30. I personally have excel spreadsheets that tell me, to the credit, where I'll be in 3 days, a week, and a month. Guess what? I'm almost exactly where I predicted I would be a month ago. How many of the "lower" players have the same predictive capabilities? How many of them have an exact plan that says where their research will be in a week, how many servers will be infected, and what's the best AP/hpd ratio? I'd warrant a guess that none of them do - that's why they're lower players. Is it a coincidence that I am where I am? No. Has IP change hurt me? A bit, but not much. IMO, is it a oversight that defeats the ENTIRE purpose of this game? Yes. Who will play a hacking game where you always get away with murder? Leave the game the way it is, and find out.

[HJ®]

Option #4: Increase the minimum system requirements for IP Change. This shouldn't affect the "lower players" too much (How low can you go?), as a Format is a much easier option when you're a "lower player" and there's almost no need for an IP change when you're that low of a player, as you're under newbie protection. The only case is when you're disinfecting, and how many players under 1GhZ CPU will be disinfecting + IP changing? . Of course, this all depends what a lower player is. Anyone from #11 on?

Like it's been said before, we all started on even playing fields, why is the game easier for newer players and harder for us now?